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Nov. 23rd, 2025 10:11 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
imperfectionisperfection posting in ![[community profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/community.png){kind=small}
uoxhttps://forums.uooutlands.com/index.php?threads/feedback-too-unfriendly-to-new-players.5817/
this post will go over negative and positive parts of the game. im writing this offline actually as my internet connection here is flakey. ill upload in several parts i guess since i dont know the limit. im not really negative against anything. i have some suggestions, but i had many for runescape, but its a multi million dollar thing so i had no way in its change or non change.
people dont talk of builds often, they get scared in the game when i ask. but like i said further down, what i prefer the most in gaming is talking to other people. even back in the days with first person shooters as far back as quake. its the experience of playing with other people. pks are usually shutins that way.
what was most fun about quake is anyone could make a skin or player model or map for the game. then anyone could set up a server allowing that map to be played. i think thats lost in mmorpgs nowadays, even cosmetics go around board meetings to figure out if it should purple or green or yellow, or if it should be a horse or a unicorn.
in the original multiplayer fashion, we needed no meetings to decide to be creative. we just were creative. and many people, like dire protofiend and dhabih eng, got hired for their fanart.
hey, maybe i wont post this on the forums just on my homepage. its missing some love. this is at almost 13000 characters, i guess the max posting length might be 5k.
whats funny is, i quit magic resist because i kept getting attacked by 2 mages at once. since then, ive played a month now, the pks have surely been 99% mages. 1 ranger who did take 30 secs to kill me. and thats whats needed. i mean they could gang up 4 rangers and kill me pretty quickly still, like approach from 2-4 ways, since they somehow always know exactly where you are and what loot you have. as in good loot. they can smell it. nowadays i just let the mages kill me, i dont try to fight back which is near impossible anyway. it doesnt concern me. now theyre even cheaper, they use paralyze, exploding potion, explode, flamestrike. it was funny, i have a lumberjacker carpenter archer. and i was attacked, but also another guy protected me, and when i got a paralyze on me i managed to hit the mage several times with my arrows. i ended up giving him a run for his money, i chased him, low on health, for long, but then he just used invisibility. easily magery is 10 skills in 1, and you can get it for 100 skillpoints or less.
what id like to say is, start another shard, with 1 single edit. just dont allow magery. dont do anything else with it. allow people to migrate their characters there.
something else is just allowing people to have 1 character and 1 character only. seige perilous had this. but with vpn it would be easy i guess to setup several. but there are characteristics in place to stop this. like literally i tried to register on discord again while having been banned for saying 4 words (thats even worse than pking, ive noticed the same on reddit, whole account banned from disagreeing with someone, i wasnt even swearing, with the reply "if you try to circumvent this well ip ban you") and it just doesnt allow me on the server for outlands anymore.
this would stop banksitter pking. what am i talking about? people banksit with their pretty gear in prevalia, but no one talks, ive tried to spur up conversations there but nothing. as soon as you step out of guards, 20 secs to a minute max, you get pkd, if you have marginally good gear. thats because they scour for noobs then just go to their other pk account.
but i know why this hasnt been fixed. because the admins have their own mage pks, where they rack up their monopoly money.
its nice this writing, i have seen several before. but nothing will ever be done. like the "taming update" in tibal tomb? 5 new levels which barely add anything and have huge xp requirements? thats it? for a huge update? but they can so easily add cosmetics, why not accidentally unbalance the game for non mages?
how about support skills not giving damage but giving defence? like thief skills giving magic resist, so you can rack up 300 magic resist if you want with a single resource gathering one.
"The PvP and open-world risk are core to UO’s design and won’t be changing."
thats just plain embarassing. you nerfed poisoning to the ground. now bleed does 10x if not more damage on swordsmen, even if youre out of range. you have the power to make it more fun for newbs.
like seriously, no one uses good quality weapons or armour, because they just get pkd then. so you made the essence system for magic items. now when i get one i just get disapointed. especially in diablo 2, getting an item drop, before the lod expansion, was fun. rare items, sets, uniques, real fun. even with the remaster i still get a big smile from getting a charm, real good idea there. but here? the only real fun is in pking.
"Playing a backstabber"
like i said, magery has several free skills in one. like invisiblity is basicaly better than grandmaster hiding. you can hide a few tiles away from someone, and unless they happen to have detect hidden you have your grey flag when invis wears off.
it would be cool if stealthers were more rewarded. like you could do more things while hidden at higher levels. like mine and lumber for example. without any sound too. but i know im talking for deaf ears, since like i mentioned the "big patch" did near zero edits to normal players.
the problem with using a stealther is i like meeting people. i dont want to hide away in fear. ive had many good conversations in outlands, actually better than any other game out there, since i started gaming online in 1995.
like someone said though, a 1000 boards? thats silly. if you get pkd while you have a 1000, why not go to town every 200? why not level craft to 0 every 100 boards?
"The problem with your suggestion of a PvE server, is it would draw many of the PvE players away from the current world, which would then lead to a drought of content for thieves and PKs."
thats the silliest thing ive ever heard. the pks can pk eachother for an actual effort, the thieves can steal that incredible reagent loot from the pks.
"I also believe that PvE players would get bored of farming unabated"
like i said, good varied hard to get magic items would make it fun. like vanilla has had for a long time.
"In regards to gathering, it's perfectly legal to use a script that recalls you to safety when you detect a red through tracking. "
yes, like ive been saying, its also perfectly legal in pvp to use scripts, even town struggles, everyone does it, very few pks even play the game. i mean paralyze, exploding potion, explode, flamestrike, doesnt take many braincells to use that. and thus is very easy to bot.
"If you have GM wrestling/combat skill"
like i said, i have no idea what youre talking about. its 99% mage pks.
the most depressing thing, which is also good, is my favourite town is horseshoe bay. there arent really many else to choose from except prevalia in terms of population, and like i said no one talks there. even just unloading things in town and crafting, i often find people to talk to. many times while pvming.
i currently have 10 different characters in outlands, and in vanilla i had 5 with vastly different skillsets. my main pk actually has cooking here, and it warmed my heart when my 2000 cooked ribs got sold. theres really a market for homebaked goods, nice. yes, a guy was so nice who i met in the beginning he actually gave me a vendor.
same thing for me in the beginning in prevalia, a girl just came up to me and gave me a mount, noticed i was a noob. in vanilla you need 95 taming and lore to get a bonded i think, so i had no idea. just so many helpful people.
yeah, so im writing this offline, my internet connection is horrible where im at right now. so this writing is taking a turn.
i prefer my pvmers, they all have different combat skills, i havent tried out arcane yet though. instead of mindboring just clicking to get resources, i instead kill monsters. doesnt have to be that high level, only harpies, and you get good items from them. yes not magic ones, but lots of other loot. i check on the vendor site, and damn, 9-30k for a quite popular item! this allows me to.
as for the harpy nest near horseshoe bay, yeah there are pks there sometimes. not that often though. and like i said, as soon as i get a magic item or other rare drop, i head to town.
ive helped out several newbs eventhough yes ive only played a month. it doesnt take much. give them some gold, advice, skill build ideas, and a level 1 mount.
1 thing id like is better auto retaliate. if you get attacked by a melee character, you hit back, the most problems i have in pvp stems from having to find the mage pk to double click on him really. if you auto retaliated with archery that would be incredibly powerful mage deterrant weapon.
same thing for pets, i tried my tamer when the horseshoe bay killer was there, and they didnt even attack him on "all guard", thats sad.
as for the original poster, if you have to run away quickly, then really magery with recall is a requirement. you can still be a pvm dexxer build with this, it doesnt require a lot of mana.
"AND get this. If your ghost is visible to them, oftentimes they will rez you."
i have never experienced that unfortunately. lately they just pk me over and over again, even a thief that stole all my gear did it.
as for cost in pking, yeah its a lot. 3 days of logged in time is a lot for each pk. yeah you can afk that way but i dont. my pk is red for life, and its not that fun.
it was fun having my first 20k and buying gold armour, but obviously i got pkd quickly. also buying an avarite sword, managed to keep it for a few days, then i lost that as well. i swear though the armour in question gave me better loot, even after i didnt use it?
again, i dont hear many people talking about this. but the PTP, player talk player, is just the best here ever. theres so many nice folks to talk to. before in runecape when i played it more i often met people to talk to hours for, and its true here as well.
when people are fake in real life and fake on social media, its such a breath of fresh air to meet a real geek who you can talk for real with, about anything really. being a musician as well i often bring that up, and more than once ive met other music makers in the game.
one thing that makes me sad, is on my tailor and blacksmith, making exceptional shadowleather or dull copper items, and it taking like 1000s of resources to make at my 70 in skills. then some days later i get pkd, and looted dry. do they hang up these items in their houses or what? what inspires these people to break crafters?
what made me happy though, is i got exceptional leather and ringmail armour sold on my vendor i made myself. so you can still make money as long as you price it well, since its a global market.
"I too have tried to find a guild"
like someone said on reddit, create your own. you get benefits. mine is number 1877. so theres not that many. i somehow have 7 prestige, maybe from inviting other players? i only had my own characters in it in the beginning, but it makes things easier, like exchanging gold to my main so he can buy items.
as for using high level items, i manage that sometimes for 2-3-4 days, then i get pkd, then i buy the items again, and get pkd, then i give up lol.
and it is real profitable to pk, i do it especially with my stealther, just like the original poster said, i managed to pk a lumberjack just outside prevalia with 1300 boards. that gave me a lot of arrows which i hate crafting and i wont buy them off of an npc. i was thinking of a stealth archer, maybe i could get in 2 shots with heavy crossbow and down them? why not do it cheap maybe with a stealth mage?
as always in a true sandbox game like ultima online, i havent really found any others, world of warcraft was a joke, you have so many ways to build your character. make something unique, thats what the rpg stands for, and the mmo means cooperation, start talking to people around you. make a tamer lumberjack or a tamer miner, if you got a dragon i assure you pks will let you be, they wont even be able to spot you behind all those pixels.
as for dungeons, i just find them depressing. i want freedom. just like i didnt play in felucca in vanilla since all trees were barren there. i want life. in the original with liches and lich lords hanging around the wilderness you couldnt just script your way around it. many parts of the game arent frequented by pks. so the wilderness can be pretty safe.
in runescape i again used the wilderness a lot, eventhough it was a pk area specically. it just felt more free.
"which is why i come back. its the freedom, being too kind hearted or despicable always costs you in the long run."
well said, i guess this flaky internet connection has made me read more, reflect more. since i downloaded this then my internet just broke.
like i said previously, it would be nice, eventhough im sorta against it, if complete mules just got loads of defensive and not offensive bonuses to them.
people have been talking about glass cannons. yeah, like i said, on my swordsman i dropped magic resist, now that im grandmaster in most skills, added focus as well, i cant have much in it although with skill max at 720 soon ill try to get 35 resist if that helps anyway, since parrying is raising slowly. but yes hes a glass cannon, dont think he even does better against gargoyles than my 70 skills archer tradesman. i seriously dont want magic resist to add swing speed, it should add magic resist.
as for codex, i was using platemail armour at first. tried to add meditation, but my mana was still going down. now i use ringmail on my dexxers. and the mana fills up all the time from codex use. havent seen this mentioned anywhere.
"even a temple with some weird cutists that offered quests. And as rewards for completing the quests they will let a new player read their most books"
great idea. it would be nice if you could bulk-copy books. i guess its not that difficult with copy and paste but i havent checked it out really. i managed to loot a guy who had adult ahem books on him with ascii beautiful people art.
or that you just had a vendor in town like a banker who sold newb tips books for 100gp each. they could come with quests and unlocking, like, if you mine too much or lumber too much you wouldnt complete the quest, or if you pvm for 2 hours youd lose it as well, only if you went to town often would you manage it.
and as for that, just remove pack animals. its only useful for mining, and its not really that since the pk chance is too high. would make it better for newbs.
this post will go over negative and positive parts of the game. im writing this offline actually as my internet connection here is flakey. ill upload in several parts i guess since i dont know the limit. im not really negative against anything. i have some suggestions, but i had many for runescape, but its a multi million dollar thing so i had no way in its change or non change.
people dont talk of builds often, they get scared in the game when i ask. but like i said further down, what i prefer the most in gaming is talking to other people. even back in the days with first person shooters as far back as quake. its the experience of playing with other people. pks are usually shutins that way.
what was most fun about quake is anyone could make a skin or player model or map for the game. then anyone could set up a server allowing that map to be played. i think thats lost in mmorpgs nowadays, even cosmetics go around board meetings to figure out if it should purple or green or yellow, or if it should be a horse or a unicorn.
in the original multiplayer fashion, we needed no meetings to decide to be creative. we just were creative. and many people, like dire protofiend and dhabih eng, got hired for their fanart.
hey, maybe i wont post this on the forums just on my homepage. its missing some love. this is at almost 13000 characters, i guess the max posting length might be 5k.
whats funny is, i quit magic resist because i kept getting attacked by 2 mages at once. since then, ive played a month now, the pks have surely been 99% mages. 1 ranger who did take 30 secs to kill me. and thats whats needed. i mean they could gang up 4 rangers and kill me pretty quickly still, like approach from 2-4 ways, since they somehow always know exactly where you are and what loot you have. as in good loot. they can smell it. nowadays i just let the mages kill me, i dont try to fight back which is near impossible anyway. it doesnt concern me. now theyre even cheaper, they use paralyze, exploding potion, explode, flamestrike. it was funny, i have a lumberjacker carpenter archer. and i was attacked, but also another guy protected me, and when i got a paralyze on me i managed to hit the mage several times with my arrows. i ended up giving him a run for his money, i chased him, low on health, for long, but then he just used invisibility. easily magery is 10 skills in 1, and you can get it for 100 skillpoints or less.
what id like to say is, start another shard, with 1 single edit. just dont allow magery. dont do anything else with it. allow people to migrate their characters there.
something else is just allowing people to have 1 character and 1 character only. seige perilous had this. but with vpn it would be easy i guess to setup several. but there are characteristics in place to stop this. like literally i tried to register on discord again while having been banned for saying 4 words (thats even worse than pking, ive noticed the same on reddit, whole account banned from disagreeing with someone, i wasnt even swearing, with the reply "if you try to circumvent this well ip ban you") and it just doesnt allow me on the server for outlands anymore.
this would stop banksitter pking. what am i talking about? people banksit with their pretty gear in prevalia, but no one talks, ive tried to spur up conversations there but nothing. as soon as you step out of guards, 20 secs to a minute max, you get pkd, if you have marginally good gear. thats because they scour for noobs then just go to their other pk account.
but i know why this hasnt been fixed. because the admins have their own mage pks, where they rack up their monopoly money.
its nice this writing, i have seen several before. but nothing will ever be done. like the "taming update" in tibal tomb? 5 new levels which barely add anything and have huge xp requirements? thats it? for a huge update? but they can so easily add cosmetics, why not accidentally unbalance the game for non mages?
how about support skills not giving damage but giving defence? like thief skills giving magic resist, so you can rack up 300 magic resist if you want with a single resource gathering one.
"The PvP and open-world risk are core to UO’s design and won’t be changing."
thats just plain embarassing. you nerfed poisoning to the ground. now bleed does 10x if not more damage on swordsmen, even if youre out of range. you have the power to make it more fun for newbs.
like seriously, no one uses good quality weapons or armour, because they just get pkd then. so you made the essence system for magic items. now when i get one i just get disapointed. especially in diablo 2, getting an item drop, before the lod expansion, was fun. rare items, sets, uniques, real fun. even with the remaster i still get a big smile from getting a charm, real good idea there. but here? the only real fun is in pking.
"Playing a backstabber"
like i said, magery has several free skills in one. like invisiblity is basicaly better than grandmaster hiding. you can hide a few tiles away from someone, and unless they happen to have detect hidden you have your grey flag when invis wears off.
it would be cool if stealthers were more rewarded. like you could do more things while hidden at higher levels. like mine and lumber for example. without any sound too. but i know im talking for deaf ears, since like i mentioned the "big patch" did near zero edits to normal players.
the problem with using a stealther is i like meeting people. i dont want to hide away in fear. ive had many good conversations in outlands, actually better than any other game out there, since i started gaming online in 1995.
like someone said though, a 1000 boards? thats silly. if you get pkd while you have a 1000, why not go to town every 200? why not level craft to 0 every 100 boards?
"The problem with your suggestion of a PvE server, is it would draw many of the PvE players away from the current world, which would then lead to a drought of content for thieves and PKs."
thats the silliest thing ive ever heard. the pks can pk eachother for an actual effort, the thieves can steal that incredible reagent loot from the pks.
"I also believe that PvE players would get bored of farming unabated"
like i said, good varied hard to get magic items would make it fun. like vanilla has had for a long time.
"In regards to gathering, it's perfectly legal to use a script that recalls you to safety when you detect a red through tracking. "
yes, like ive been saying, its also perfectly legal in pvp to use scripts, even town struggles, everyone does it, very few pks even play the game. i mean paralyze, exploding potion, explode, flamestrike, doesnt take many braincells to use that. and thus is very easy to bot.
"If you have GM wrestling/combat skill"
like i said, i have no idea what youre talking about. its 99% mage pks.
the most depressing thing, which is also good, is my favourite town is horseshoe bay. there arent really many else to choose from except prevalia in terms of population, and like i said no one talks there. even just unloading things in town and crafting, i often find people to talk to. many times while pvming.
i currently have 10 different characters in outlands, and in vanilla i had 5 with vastly different skillsets. my main pk actually has cooking here, and it warmed my heart when my 2000 cooked ribs got sold. theres really a market for homebaked goods, nice. yes, a guy was so nice who i met in the beginning he actually gave me a vendor.
same thing for me in the beginning in prevalia, a girl just came up to me and gave me a mount, noticed i was a noob. in vanilla you need 95 taming and lore to get a bonded i think, so i had no idea. just so many helpful people.
yeah, so im writing this offline, my internet connection is horrible where im at right now. so this writing is taking a turn.
i prefer my pvmers, they all have different combat skills, i havent tried out arcane yet though. instead of mindboring just clicking to get resources, i instead kill monsters. doesnt have to be that high level, only harpies, and you get good items from them. yes not magic ones, but lots of other loot. i check on the vendor site, and damn, 9-30k for a quite popular item! this allows me to.
as for the harpy nest near horseshoe bay, yeah there are pks there sometimes. not that often though. and like i said, as soon as i get a magic item or other rare drop, i head to town.
ive helped out several newbs eventhough yes ive only played a month. it doesnt take much. give them some gold, advice, skill build ideas, and a level 1 mount.
1 thing id like is better auto retaliate. if you get attacked by a melee character, you hit back, the most problems i have in pvp stems from having to find the mage pk to double click on him really. if you auto retaliated with archery that would be incredibly powerful mage deterrant weapon.
same thing for pets, i tried my tamer when the horseshoe bay killer was there, and they didnt even attack him on "all guard", thats sad.
as for the original poster, if you have to run away quickly, then really magery with recall is a requirement. you can still be a pvm dexxer build with this, it doesnt require a lot of mana.
"AND get this. If your ghost is visible to them, oftentimes they will rez you."
i have never experienced that unfortunately. lately they just pk me over and over again, even a thief that stole all my gear did it.
as for cost in pking, yeah its a lot. 3 days of logged in time is a lot for each pk. yeah you can afk that way but i dont. my pk is red for life, and its not that fun.
it was fun having my first 20k and buying gold armour, but obviously i got pkd quickly. also buying an avarite sword, managed to keep it for a few days, then i lost that as well. i swear though the armour in question gave me better loot, even after i didnt use it?
again, i dont hear many people talking about this. but the PTP, player talk player, is just the best here ever. theres so many nice folks to talk to. before in runecape when i played it more i often met people to talk to hours for, and its true here as well.
when people are fake in real life and fake on social media, its such a breath of fresh air to meet a real geek who you can talk for real with, about anything really. being a musician as well i often bring that up, and more than once ive met other music makers in the game.
one thing that makes me sad, is on my tailor and blacksmith, making exceptional shadowleather or dull copper items, and it taking like 1000s of resources to make at my 70 in skills. then some days later i get pkd, and looted dry. do they hang up these items in their houses or what? what inspires these people to break crafters?
what made me happy though, is i got exceptional leather and ringmail armour sold on my vendor i made myself. so you can still make money as long as you price it well, since its a global market.
"I too have tried to find a guild"
like someone said on reddit, create your own. you get benefits. mine is number 1877. so theres not that many. i somehow have 7 prestige, maybe from inviting other players? i only had my own characters in it in the beginning, but it makes things easier, like exchanging gold to my main so he can buy items.
as for using high level items, i manage that sometimes for 2-3-4 days, then i get pkd, then i buy the items again, and get pkd, then i give up lol.
and it is real profitable to pk, i do it especially with my stealther, just like the original poster said, i managed to pk a lumberjack just outside prevalia with 1300 boards. that gave me a lot of arrows which i hate crafting and i wont buy them off of an npc. i was thinking of a stealth archer, maybe i could get in 2 shots with heavy crossbow and down them? why not do it cheap maybe with a stealth mage?
as always in a true sandbox game like ultima online, i havent really found any others, world of warcraft was a joke, you have so many ways to build your character. make something unique, thats what the rpg stands for, and the mmo means cooperation, start talking to people around you. make a tamer lumberjack or a tamer miner, if you got a dragon i assure you pks will let you be, they wont even be able to spot you behind all those pixels.
as for dungeons, i just find them depressing. i want freedom. just like i didnt play in felucca in vanilla since all trees were barren there. i want life. in the original with liches and lich lords hanging around the wilderness you couldnt just script your way around it. many parts of the game arent frequented by pks. so the wilderness can be pretty safe.
in runescape i again used the wilderness a lot, eventhough it was a pk area specically. it just felt more free.
"which is why i come back. its the freedom, being too kind hearted or despicable always costs you in the long run."
well said, i guess this flaky internet connection has made me read more, reflect more. since i downloaded this then my internet just broke.
like i said previously, it would be nice, eventhough im sorta against it, if complete mules just got loads of defensive and not offensive bonuses to them.
people have been talking about glass cannons. yeah, like i said, on my swordsman i dropped magic resist, now that im grandmaster in most skills, added focus as well, i cant have much in it although with skill max at 720 soon ill try to get 35 resist if that helps anyway, since parrying is raising slowly. but yes hes a glass cannon, dont think he even does better against gargoyles than my 70 skills archer tradesman. i seriously dont want magic resist to add swing speed, it should add magic resist.
as for codex, i was using platemail armour at first. tried to add meditation, but my mana was still going down. now i use ringmail on my dexxers. and the mana fills up all the time from codex use. havent seen this mentioned anywhere.
"even a temple with some weird cutists that offered quests. And as rewards for completing the quests they will let a new player read their most books"
great idea. it would be nice if you could bulk-copy books. i guess its not that difficult with copy and paste but i havent checked it out really. i managed to loot a guy who had adult ahem books on him with ascii beautiful people art.
or that you just had a vendor in town like a banker who sold newb tips books for 100gp each. they could come with quests and unlocking, like, if you mine too much or lumber too much you wouldnt complete the quest, or if you pvm for 2 hours youd lose it as well, only if you went to town often would you manage it.
and as for that, just remove pack animals. its only useful for mining, and its not really that since the pk chance is too high. would make it better for newbs.
